Thanks Bruce, I knew there must have been two daughters as there are 2 grandchildren living with Ellen Hudgson in the1861census
Thomas Shimmin b1859 and Louisa Madrell b1855 . The only marriage to a Shimmin i have found so far is a Jane Hudgeon and Thomas Shimmin living in Douglas in the 1861 census but it gives her birthplace as Douglas, and achild called John born about 1859 and another son called Thomas born about 1857. So whether that is the right one I don't know yet. As for the 1841 and 1851 census there is something in the MFHS library at Peel so I will have a look this weekend
Thanks again Mike