thanks brian all this searching just get a bit to much sometimes, the cains john thomas and julia in 1901 cenus will be my lot as there daughter catherine born 1900 was my dads mum,so thhat part is correct , i didnt do the research on john s parents it was my nephew he came over yesterday and gave me copies but he gave me 1901/1891/1881/1861 but missed 1871 which you gave me a while ago so do you think we are on the wrong cains...john was born in patrick,
my mums side was cains as well and oddly enough my dad was born dec 1921 and mum may 1921 but my mums dad was manx and her mum was from manchester, its my dads side thats given me problems