Hi,

Without wishing to get at all involved in the detail of this thread I have a just a couple of observations resulting from the work done in the Manx DNA study.

1. There is a group of Manx-born Cains who are haplogroup R1a - which suggests an early Northern European/Scandinavian origin for the man who founded this particular family - they are totally different from and genetically unconnected to:
2. A group of Manx-born Cains who are haplogroup R1b - some of which are tested to be M222 +ve. This may be the same Cain family as in 1 above - but there has been an illegitimacy or adoption at some early date in the male line. Or they may have been descended from an earlier Irish Cain clan.
3. The M222 genetic marker or SNP has been deemed to be suggestive of an Ui Neill heritage but is concentrated in an area in the Northwest of Ireland and is also found in the peoples of the area surrounding Ireland, including the Isle of Man.
4. There is at least one other Manx family that is known to be tested M222 +ve so far - and a number of other Manx families have been shown to have their male genetic origins in Ireland and elsewhere - ie they came to the Isle of Man from elsewhere and settled there - before becoming Manx - and in many cases before family names were used - and so their Manx names were created and adopted after they had come to the Island from elsewhere. Does that make them Irish or Scottish or Manx?

So the conclusion is that there are a number of Cains of different genetic origins around - and within a genealogy timeframe a genetic profile does not necessarily confer nationality.

I hope this helps,

John